- [Narrator] Peter and Ann Pretorius,

co-founders of Jesus Alive Ministries

and Joint Aid Management,

have led over 12 millionAfricans to salvation

and provided more than 1.2billion meals to starving people.

Prior to Peter's death in August of 2018,

he shared his story of howGod used an ordinary man

to bring hope and healingto a devastated nation

in his book, Death-Defying Faith.

- Well, Ann and Isak Pretorius are here,

and just say, it's an honor have you.

- Thank you.

- You guys are real pioneersin doing open evangelism

throughout Africa, andit's an honor to have you.

- Thank you, it's beenan interesting road.

More than three decades of pioneering

and opening up new avenuesand just letting God lead us,

and we were so ill-equipped for it,

because our lives weregoing were going on one path

and God turned everything aroundand took us on another one.

- [Gordon] But isn't thatprecisely what you need?

- It's exactly what we needed,

- To say,

- Exactly what He needed

- If you think that you're equipped,

then suddenly the glory comesto you instead of to Him

and it's because you feelill-equipped that you say

"Well, I need to be dependent on him."

- Absolutely. And that dependence has been

very, very strong every step of the way,

and Peter really builtan amazing foundation

that after his passing last year,

he didn't leave us ill-equipped.

It's the same as when Jesus left.

He said, "I'm leaving, but" and Peter left

and I think the bookis an incredible legacy

of the foundation, of the adventures,

the challenge to people who can read it

to see what faith actually did

and how simply God used uswithout any formal qualification.

But He divinely enabledus to do something amazing

and that's why it didn't die,

the vision didn't die with Peter.

The vision is so vibrant and so strong,

and it's so beautiful tohave my family involved,

Isak being one of them,who's just so passionate,

loves to preach, lovesto be totally involved

in getting the message out there,

not just in the preaching of the gospel,

but in the demonstration of the gospel

in caring for the poor.

- [Gordon] Isak, I've gotto ask this, you grew up in

this, and so when did you knowthat this was your call too?

- Dad would actually tell the story of,

I think I was around about five years old,

and I came to him and Isaid, "Dad, God's called me

"to be an evangelist."

And he thought that was cute, you know?

Fireman's son wants to be a fireman.

And so he thought that was kinda cute

and he was sorta proud of it,

but said he was praying the next day

and God said to him,"What your son told you

"is what I told him"

and so, there was a real sense

from a young kid, and I wasexplaining to your dad earlier

how my upbringing was a privileged one,

and you say that to people,and they kind of picture

a certain story, butit was so the opposite.

My privilege was that I went with my dad

and got to experiencepoverty in its most extreme.

From being a young, youngkid, and yet what I saw

in that poverty was anopportunity to express God's heart

and to extend God's hands,and I had this example

of a father that just showed me that,

if you had death-defying faith,

that you could achieve anything.

And he would constantlytell me how ill-equipped

he was to be doing what he was doing,

and yet if we put our faith in God,

and I remember, when Ifirst started preaching

in the mass outreach meetings,

which was just the mostincredible experience,

but also, I mean, nerve-wracking,

I've never been so scared in my life,

and I said to Dad,

"I'm okay with delivering a message.

"I'm okay with, you know,praying the prayer of salvation

"with people. But howdo I pray for the sick?

"What if no one getshealed? What do I do?"

and he said, "Understand two things.

"Firstly, don't ever, ever, ever think

"that you can heal anyone,okay? It's not you.

"The day you think it is,the healings will stop.

"Secondly, don't ever take responsibility

"for whether they get healed or not.

"All you're there to do is connect them

"with the supernatural power of God

"and that's between them and God."

And it was a release forme, cause it just showed me

that, hang on, I can do this thing,

cause it's not about me.

It's not about my capability,it's not about my talent.

It's about the Jesusthat empowers me to do it

because it's not for me.

Any gift that was givento me was given to me

for those that I'm required to serve,

and not for me.

So, it was a privilegegrowing up like that.

I experienced some things that maybe

young kids shouldn't have seen,

and have dealt with some of the trauma

of experiencing thattoo, but I fell in love

with our continent, you know?

The people of Africa arethe most phenomenal people.

They have such an entrepreneurial spirit,

because most Africans, youhave to be an entrepreneur

just to survive from one day to the next.

And they also have anincredible spirituality.

You know, people often say tome, "Why do you think it is

"that you see the miraclesyou see in Africa,

"and we don't see themin our church in Europe

"or in America? You know,the blind see, the deaf yell,

"like we've never seen that. How?

"Why do you think it is?"

And I say to people, I thinkthere's two key reasons.

The one is that oftenin the developed world,

Jesus is our last resort.

To many of these people,Jesus is their only option.

And secondly, is thefact that African people

grow up understanding thenegative spiritual world.

They grow up with ancestral worship.

They grow up with witchcraft.

They understand, see, and believe

the negative spiritual world.

So when you stand up andyou say, Jesus loves you

and He wants to heal you,whether that be physical healing,

emotional healing, theysay, "I believe this."

And where does healing come from?

Where does the miracle of Jesus come from?

It's faith. It's puttingour faith in Christ

and believing that what He saysHe'll do for us He will do.

And so I think that's thereally the power and the gift

that Dad gave us, thelegacy that was there.

We got an inheritanceof knowing Jesus and,

- [Gordon] That's a rich inheritance.

- And knowing how to take the gospel.

- And most people nevereven touch into that.

Yes, there is a kingdomthat is hard to see

but at the same time,when it demonstrates,

it gets very easy to see.

Well, let me talk to youabout the beginning days,

cause one of the thingsI like about the book

are your sort of inside takes, your view,

of what's going on.- Yeah.

- And I've got to go back to the point

where Peter comes to youand say, "God has told me

to give away all our savings."

What was your immediate reaction to that?

- [Ann] My immediate reactionwas concern for my children,

with six children, and I wasconcerned about the lean years,

and it wasn't because I wasafraid of managing through,

going without, it was morethat I wanted my children

to see a God of provision,to know the goodness of God.

And I was really worriedthat giving everything away

would mean that they wouldthink that's how it has to be,

that's God's a God who deprives you.

- [Gordon] Yeah. If you're inministry, it made you poor.

- That's right. And that'sthe last thing that I wanted.

So, that was an initial reaction.

And then, when he saidto me he was praying

and God said to him, "Ifyou'll give Me everything

that's yours, all I have is yours,"

and immediately I got so excited,

I said, "That's the bestexchange I've ever heard of."

And we did go through lean years, Gordon,

and there were times when it was tough.

You know, Isak was still tiny then

and he knew those lean years.

But our children grew upseeing the supernatural,

divine provision of God,and they saw a mom and dad

who were continually trusting God,

whether it was their sports equipment

or you know, somethingpersonal for them or

for the ministry, thatI think the exposure

that they had to seeing andfeeling a heart of the poor

helped them really stand with us in faith,

saying, "God's gotta help these people,"

and so their need became secondary,

and I think that's anincredible value for children.

- [Gordon] Did you ever wanna give up?

- There were times I wanted to give up.

There was one particulartime where I cried out to God

and I said, "Oh God, whydo you send us to these

God-forsaken, terrible, war-torn places?"

And He answered me, but not in the way

I was hoping He would.(laughter)

He does that.- He does that.

- And He said, "Because you'll go."

And suddenly, the privilegeof being called of God

to go to places where others didn't go,

didn't want to go, couldn't go,

I suddenly realized what an honor it is.

So God has a way ofbalancing those things.

When we get too focusedon self or concern,

if we'll truly cry out toHim, He is our solution,

and He shows us the reason we're there.

- Alright. Well, we couldgo on about these insights

but if you want to knowmore, the book is called

"Death-Defying Faith:The Extraordinary Life of

Miracle Man Peter Pretorius".

You can find it wherever books are sold.