- TikTok, you know, people talk about it

as surveilling U.S.users and yes, it does.

Apple caught twice this yearin April and June doing that.

But also TikTok, many people believe

has been surreptitiouslydownloading software

on user devices and the biggest sin of all

is China's manipulation ofAmerican political opinion

through TikTok.

TikTok has very powerfulartificial intelligence.

They use it to influenceAmericans by the videos

that they see, because thoseare curated by algorithms

that are actually developed in Beijing

and then inserted into the TikTok software

in the United States.

- And recently Iinterviewed Robert Spalding

at Hudson Institute.

He says the greater threatfrom China in the future

may not be a military one,

but their moves todominate global technology.

Now that's the subject of your book.

How important is it for the United States

to challenge China in the high tech area?

- Well, it's absolutelycritical because high technology

is gonna dominate theeconomy of the world.

And we want Americansto have that technology.

China's been stealing it byhundreds of billions of dollars

a year of intellectual property.

And so clearly Beijingfeels this is important.

Xi Jinping, the Chineseruler, has his made in China

2025 plan to dominate first 10 and now 11

critical tech sectors.

So this is the spacerace of the 21st century.

- And how about Chinese efforts, Gordon,

to change the outcome ofthe November election?

You alluded to this aboutinfluence on social media,

like TikTok.

So how great is that effort,

in addition to just electronic hacking?

I know the president says theycould print mail in ballots.

So how likely is that?

- Well, you know, China could very well be

trying to mess with the infrastructure

of the electoral process.

'Cause much of it isdone online these days.

But what I focus on iswhat China has been doing

to manipulate opinion.

So for instance, therehave been these malicious

disinformation campaignsabout the coronavirus

and about the George Floyd protests,

but also China is got it'stroll farms operating.

So we've got all of these fake accounts.

And Twitter, for instance, in June,

took down 174,000 fake Chinese accounts.

Other social media platformshave done the same thing.

Just last week they found another one

or they know about another one

and they actually startedto move against it.

That's the Spamouflage Dragon operation.

So China has been workingvery, very intensely

and they are going to be in our election

much more than Russia was in, in 2016.

- And it's not just theirefforts to influence the election

through public opinion, butI've got to ask you about

the mistreatment of Christians in China

because that's getting worse.

And the independenceof the Catholic church

is almost nonexistent now.

There's a crackdown against

house churches that's intensifying.

Why now Gordon?

- Well, Xi Jinping, Iguess, feels that faith

is the enemy of communism.

And so we have seenmoves across the board.

It's not just Christianity,of course, it's also Islam.

And even, you know, and this is

absolutely fascinating, Gary,they're going after Buddhism,

which is considered tobe a Chinese religion.

So really what it now is,is a full front campaign.

And I think it's becauseXi Jinping believes

he's got the ability to do it

with his total surveillance state.

And I think he feels insecure enough

so that he believes that now is the time.

- And something Mao never had, right?

So what should we do aboutthese China challenges, Gordon?

Will it really make a difference

no matter who wins thepresidential election in November?

Can China be stopped or is it too late?

- Oh, we can easily stop China.

And the moves that PresidentTrump has been taking recently

have been extremely effective,

especially the ones against Huawei

and of course the trade issueswith the section 301 tariffs.

We got to remember, Gary,that every American president

tries in the first year in office

to come to some sort ofaccommodation with Beijing.

And president Trump did that in 2017.

You know, if Biden were elected,

and this is forgetting abouthow Biden feels about China,

but if Biden were elected,he would be wasting months

and maybe years tryingto do the same thing.

And right now we don'thave any moments to lose

because China is relentlesslyattacking us across the board.

So that's the reason why this is a concern

about the continuity of Chinapolicy, which by the way,

for the first time in three decades

is actually working to theadvantage of the United States.

- And a real sense of urgency, now.

Gordon Chang, China analyst, author of

"The Great U.S. - China Tech War".

Thank you, Gordon. We appreciate you.

Thank you for being here,sharing your insights.

- Well, thank you, Gary.

- [Announcer] And you canhear more from Gordon Chang

and Lee Smith on theJohn Durham investigation

and mail and ballotting vote frauds

all on the Global Lanetonight at 9:30 Eastern,

only on the CBN news channel.