- And as coronavirus cases trend upward,

many states are reinforcing restrictions.

The State of California'smaking it very hard

for Christians to worship.

First they banned singing in churches

to halt the spread of the coronavirus,

and then came the recent orderto ban indoor gatherings,

including home Biblestudies and fellowship.

Liberty Counsel has filed a lawsuit

on behalf of Harvest Rock Church

and Harvest International Ministry

against the governor's orders,

calling them unconstitutional.

And joining us now with more

is Liberty Counsel's founderand chairman, Mat Staver.

Mat, tell us more aboutthe governor's order

and the details surroundingyour specific lawsuit.

- Well, as you said, hebegan just a couple weeks ago

with banning singing and chantingin all houses of worship,

and that includes in-homeBible studies and fellowship,

and then about a week ago he expanded that

to all the counties on theso-called County Monitoring List.

And right now there's 30-pluscounties on that list,

and that number could grow.

In those counties, there'sno in-person service at all,

no in-person worship eitherin the church building

or in your home.

So no home Bible study,no home fellowship.

You know, 80% of Californianow has no ability,

under this order, to worship.

The governor absolutelyhas no power to do this.

It is beyond his Constitutional ability.

In fact, the First Amendmentdraws a line in the sand.

But the same governor

apparently has two versionsof the First Amendment,

one for protesters, which he encourages,

right on up through and including the ban

on in-person worship,including in your home.

And he actually encourages more of that.

We had 100,000 protestorsgather in the streets,

shoulder-to-shoulder,back-to-front, jamming the streets,

and the governor is happy about that.

He's encouraging more toengage in that kind of activity

while he's banning notonly all in-person worship,

but all in-home Biblestudies and fellowship

and that is just absolutely astounding.

- So it sounds to melike you definitely think

that churches are being unfairly targeted.

- Oh, no question about it.

I mean, we have, in our 90 page complaint

on behalf of the church

and the Harvest International Ministry,

which has 162 churchesthroughout California,

listed many of thecomments and the citations

with the governor, and heagain encourages mass protest.

Even now, when he's banningthese in-person worship services

and even in-home Bible studies,

he's encouraging people toengage in protests, even now.

And he says, in fact ifyou engage in protests

you can get a confidential COVID test,

no one will need to know

that you've actuallybeen part of the protest.

So they're not gonna report that.

I mean, that's a double-standard.

There is no First Amendment for protests,

and First Amendment that'sbasically truncated to nothing

for places of worship.

In fact, places ofworship, people of faith,

not only have the right ofindividuals for free speech

and free assembly, but thefree exercise of religion

and the government cannotestablish a religion,

going all the way back to 1947.

The Supreme Court in the Everson case

said that the EstablishmentClause means at least this,

that the government cannot force someone

to attend church against their will,

nor can they prevent someone

from attending church against their will.

And that's exactly whatthe governor is doing.

- And quickly, we've onlygot about a minute left.

We've been seeing situations like this

since the start of the pandemic,

what can be done on a federal level

to prevent governors fromissuing mandates like this?

- Well, of course, this is obviously

an individual state issue,

but I think the Presidentof the United States

can continue to use the pulpit

to encourage these governorsto back off the restrictions.

I think he can continue to do that more.

I think you can alsotie some federal funding

to these particular situationswhere they're overreaching,

and finally, the Department of Justice

needs to become moreactive than it has been

to go after these governors

that are violatingConstitutional freedoms.

- All right, Mat Staver,

the founder and chairmanof Liberty Counsel.

Thank you for your timeand your insight, sir.

- Thank you. Good to be with you.