So, Alan, you're very involved in immigration advocacy

work, and the president this week, of course,

his administration made a big announcement

about DACA and the fact that they're going to phase it out

in the next six months.

And they're really putting the pressure on Congress to act.

So what is your response to all of this?

How do you think this will play out,

and is this a good strategy or not?

It really is Congress's role to address this.

And so I'm excited to see Congress actually

take it up and solve this.

We've been talking about this for a long time,

for many years.

The Dreamers were brought here as young children, many of them

as minors definitely, and just really how

do we address this issue as a country?

And that's Congress's job.

I mean constitutionally that's what they're supposed to do.

So I'm looking forward to them taking it up.

So you're not dismayed that the president

said he's phasing it out?

No.

I mean that's-- obviously we want to see the young people

protected, the young immigrants who have come here,

but how are they going to be protected long-term?

It has to be by Congress acting.

So whatever has happened in the past,

this has happened, how that came to be and the whole thing.

We're looking forward to the future,

and we're asking Congress to do the work.

Well the bad news is Congress has not done anything.

There's been all this inaction for all these years

despite all this pressure.

So what is your hope that Congress

will do anything at this point?

We've never been in a situation like this,

where there was definitely an opportunity

to get this done in this kind of way, I think.

I think we have Democrats and Republicans both

that are seeing the gravity of this

and seeing how much this needs to be solved.

I think we're going to have a bipartisan solution,

so I'm excited.

Believe it or not, as much tension as there is,

I'm hopeful that we get to a resolution on this.

And Congress has had struggle with a lot of things

in the past, but as we talk to congressional offices

and we talk to a lot of people, there

seems to be a desire to get something done.

Are you seeing that on both sides of the aisle?

More one side of the aisle?

Yeah, Republicans and Democrats that we talk

to and the different congressional offices,

there's an urgency.

There's a sense that we have to do this.

What are you hoping for in terms of strategy?

Do you want Congress just to address DACA right now?

Do you think it would be smart to try and include

more pieces of the puzzle, you know,

a more comprehensive immigration reform approach?

Or what do you think is the right strategy?

I mean overall our immigration system has

been broken for a long time, so we've

had 30 years of inactivity, of laws not being enforced,

of people coming--

of all these things going on.

And so we would love to see comprehensive immigration

reform obviously for a variety of reasons.

But when it comes to the Dreamers,

they really are the victims of a broken system.

They were brought here as young children.

They didn't choose to come here.

They've grown up here.

This is the only country that they know.

I have friends who are Dreamers brought here at two years old.

They're now 25, 27 years old.

They don't have a memory of their home country.

So when you look at the whole thing and the whole picture,

these really are the victims of the broken system.

So from a human level, how do we--

how as Christians should we treat

victims of a broken system of government?

We should focus on them.

We should care for them.

So as far as what gets added to it

or how the whole situation goes, that's

beyond what I'm able to address.

But I'm really advocating for these young people

from a human perspective, from a biblical perspective,

from how we are to treat the sojourner and especially

people who were brought here as children.

Many of them are in their 20s now.

It's true that a lot of them aren't

children now, which speaks to how long this

has been going on, right.

But now they have children.

Quite a few of them have children who are US citizens.

And so from a justice perspective,

from a biblical justice perspective, as the church,

I encourage the church to speak to this.

And all of the other things we do,

obviously everyone wants a secure border.

We want to see these other things.

But my focus really is on the young people.

How do you think--

you're working a lot with people in churches on this issue.

How aware would you say people are of Dreamers

and their particular situation?

You know, I think at first a lot of people aren't really

aware, just the average person.

You know, they think undocumented immigrant,

and they think, oh, well you're a lawbreaker.

And then I talk to them, and I explain,

what about the one who was brought here at six months old?

I know someone in Montgomery who was brought here

at six months old, obviously no memory whatsoever.

What about the one who was brought here

at two years old and three years old?

Every time I mention that, people say,

well that's different.

Well we should do something for them.

Lots of times people say, well why can't they just get legal?

If they've been here all this time,

why won't they go get legal?

And I explain to them, there's no pathway for them

to get legal here.

They would have to go back to their home country

and possibly wait 20, 25 years.

And if this is the only country you

know, how do you navigate that?

And then I explain that, and then people say,

oh, well that makes sense.

Well we should do something for them.

I say, exactly right.

But for some reason, like you said before,

Congress and our government, we get to this point

and then we get log jammed.

And so now we're really asking Congress to get us out of this

and do something for these young people.

What are you really hoping that people in the pews

will do in the next coming months

as there is this kind of new potential for some action?

You know, I mean I've been a pastor for a long time

and speak from scripture, obviously,

and what the Bible says and God's heart

for the sojourner and God's heart for people.

How do you look at a situation and say, how can we have

mercy and also justice as well?

And immigration is a very complicated issue.

There are lots of different views on lots

of different sides of this.

But when you look at the actual person,

when you look at the people, to say, OK, how can we actually,

as the church, speak on their behalf?

I know that the church and the government are different,

but speaking on behalf of people in need,

advocating for vulnerable people is something

that we are called to do.

Proverbs 31:8-9 says to speak for those who have no voice.

So I would I would encourage Christians

who are American citizens to consider their neighbor

and consider what it means to love

their neighbor as themselves, which are these Dreamers,

and say, how can we speak for them?

Call your congressman and say, could you please solve this?

Could you get us out of this ditch

that we have been in for a long time

and solve this on behalf of these young immigrant Dreamers?

And I think God honors that.

I think God honors when the church speaks

on behalf of the vulnerable.

And I think there's a blessing there.

Isaiah 58 speaks to this, about when

we loose the chains of injustice and we spend ourselves

on behalf of the hungry and we provide the poor wanderer

with shelter, that God will shine for his light on us

and heal our land.

And so that's my prayer.

And what do you say to the Christians who

really don't think that we should help the Dreamers?

Who really say, even though they are brought here,

they are on the wrong side of the law.

They should leave.

What do you say to those people, because there are those people?

Yeah, and I understand that.

I hear that every day, and I have conversations

with people every day.

And if I could talk with them and then

say, OK, from a big picture perspective,

I hear what you're saying.

But when we look at the actual person, who

has no memory of a home country and doesn't

have resources lots of times, these aren't necessarily

wealthy people.

If you're going to bring them and drop them off in a country

that they don't know, with no resources,

if they get sent back to some of the countries

in Central America where the drug cartels are waiting

for them to show up, that seems to be a pretty cruel response.

So I understand that perspective,

but at the same time I would ask to think beyond that

to the actual person.

And our government makes laws, but then

we also correct things.

We have a history in our nation of saying,

OK, well that didn't work out quite the way we intended it

to, so now let's rectify that.

And we the people can speak.

We don't have a King.

We don't have a monarch.

We're able to speak into the process

and be a part of the process.

So I just encourage the church to speak

on behalf of people in need, especially

victims of the system who are brought here as young people,

didn't choose to come.

They didn't choose to break the law.

This is where they found themselves.

So how can we extend justice and mercy to them?

All right, well, and we've spent

a lot of time investing in them already,

so there's a lot of pieces to the puzzle.

And they have a ton to contribute.

They work hard.

The Dreamers that I've met are so

eager to try to participate and to contribute and to really

build a great life here.

Well a very interesting moment.

Alan Cross, thanks for joining us.

OK, thank you.