MAN: As a mother of four boys, author Jeannie Cunnion

says she was determined to be the perfect mom

with perfect kids.

But her plan unraveled when the stress

of pretending to have it all together

left her fearful, angry, and feeling guilty.

JEANNIE CUNNION: Moms are under so much pressure.

We're told that we have to get it all right for our kids

to turn out right.

We're told that their entire futures

are riding on our ability to perfectly orchestrate

their lives.

MAN: In Mom Set Free, Jeannie shares

how she found relief from the pressures of parenting,

and how you could become the mom you long to be for your kids.

Well, she's here-- the author of Mom Set Free.

And boy, is it a great book.

Jeannie, welcome.

Thank you.

It's good to have you with us on Interactive.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

What were some of the surprises

that you found in motherhood that you

hadn't anticipated early on?

I expected motherhood to enlarge my heart.

I had heard so much about how I would

love these kids so deeply.

TERRY MEEUWSON: Yes.

I did not expect motherhood to expose all of my weaknesses.

I did not see that coming.

I did not realize that--

TERRY MEEUWSON: If you're like me,

didn't realize how many of them you had.

JEANNIE CUNNION: I did not know how many I had,

and I didn't know how deep they ran.

TERRY MEEUWSON: Yeah.

It's a big job.

And, you know, most of us recognize fully

that God has sort of entrusted these treasured lives

into our hands.

And so we feel compelled to do it all right.

How did perfectionism and the striving for it

impact your life?

Yeah.

I really bought into that myth, that good parenting in

equals good kids out.

TERRY MEEUWSON: Yes.

And so I felt this very heavy burden, because of,

like you said, the depths of my love for them,

and my desire for good things for them--

was to put all good stuff in, so that all good stuff will

come out.

Yeah.

But only God can do that, right?

[LAUGHS]

Only God determines what comes out.

Yes.

Yes.

So how did you begin to realize

that you needed to release these unfulfilled, unrealistic

expectations you had of yourself?

Yeah.

Recognizing my significance in my kids' lives, which

is very important, but realizing that I'm not

sovereign in their lives.

Really putting God back on the throne where he belongs.

Remembering that He is the all powerful, all knowing, all

loving one, and that I get to partner and work with Him--

that He gets to use me as a vessel of His grace in my kids'

lives.

But He is not asking me to do His job.

[LAUGHS] Stay in your own lane.

That's what we say here.

Yeah.

You stay there.

I'll stay here.

And this will work just fine.

You talk a great deal in here about grace.

You know, God's grace to us-- and then, really,

that is part of our job, is expressing and giving

an example to our children in how we

respond to them of His grace.

But you know, I think we really have to first

understand that ourselves?

Do you think that we maybe aren't there yet

when we first have kids-- that we know the word "grace."

We could give some definition to it.

But experiencing it is yet another thing, isn't it?

It is.

And it took motherhood for me to understand the grace of God.

I don't know that every mom's journey is the same.

But for me, it really was becoming a mom,

and really needing to anchor my identity

and who I am in Christ that enables me to parent

my kids with grace.

You know, as I read your book, my children are grown now.

They're in their 20s and 30s.

But I have grandchildren.

And it caused me to go back and think about how I raised them

and how I parented them, and what I would do differently

if I could do it over again.

And some of it would be--

you're so specific about, our real role

is to draw them to Jesus, not to drive them

to righteousness, even.

Wow.

I mean, talk about that a little bit.

Yeah.

Because they will grow in righteousness to the degree

that Jesus has taken up residence in their hearts.

And so really our job--

I started my parenting so law-laden.

Late Really, you will love God and serve God and obey me.

As for me in my in my house.

Yes.

And if I put that on the wall and you read it every day,

that will work.

And it was a revelation of recognizing that no, it's

actually the grace of God.

It's the unconditional love of God

that is going to make them want to love Him

and serve Him and love others.

So our family verse is, love the Lord God with all your heart.

But you have to take a step back and go, OK, well, what's

going to inspire that and motivate that?

And it's not the law of God, which is important for them

to grow in His likeness.

But it's the grace of God.

It's the fact that when we fall short

and we get that wrong, He still has His arms spread wide

open to you, welcomes you, loves you, and says, hey,

I can change you.

And really, our children get that from us

not by our being perfect or not by our laying down

the ground rules.

They get it, really, by our being

honest about our own imperfection.

Absolutely.

It's our willingness to say, me too.

I struggle.

I fall.

I need Jesus, too.

Yeah.

Do you think that some people are afraid?

I have known parents who haven't been comfortable with saying

to their children, I'm sorry.

I really did that wrong.

Do you think we're afraid that we're

going to give them license to maybe not live

the way they should?

Yeah.

I think some parents fear saying, I'm sorry,

or, I have weakness, because they

fear that their children will no longer respect them--

TERRY MEEUWSON: Yes.

--obey them, look up to them.

And I think what we find as we began

to take that approach with our kids

is that it actually makes them respect us more.

TERRY MEEUWSON: Yes.

Because they no longer have to pretend

that they're pulling it off.

Because they're not either.

And they need permission in the home--

a safe place to take off their masks

and let down their guards.

Because they're under pressure, too--

a lot of pressure.

And they need a place to be safe.

And you know, this message that you

bring in Mom Set Free really is a message that needs

to be in Christian schools.

It needs to be in children's classes at church,

in the main sanctuary.

Because my kids all went to Christian school,

and we always jokingly say that no matter what

the question was, you knew the answer was Jesus.

[LAUGHTER]

--Jesus.

We say that too.

If you don't know what to say, say Jesus.

Yeah.

You're safe.

You're good to go.

Talk about the difference between condemnation

and conviction.

Yes.

I love that.

Condemnation is the voice of shame.

It's the voice of the enemy that says, shame on you.

You did wrong.

You are now unlovable-- unworthy of love.

TERRY MEEUWSON: It makes us hang our heads.

It does.

It makes you hang your heads.

And Romans 8:1 is very clear.

There is no condemnation-- none.

It doesn't say "a little."

There is no condemnation for those who are in Jesus Christ.

And there is conviction, though.

There is conviction for us.

That is the voice of Jesus beckoning to run to Him

and repent, receive mercy, and be transformed in His likeness.

What do you say to your children when you have--

because I think we all do this.

In moments of anger or frustration,

because their behavior is unacceptable

and you don't know how to change it,

and we say things that we'd so like to take back.

What do you do after that?

Shaming messages.

Yes.

You say, I'm sorry.

You say, I'm sorry.

I was not the mom I wanted to be for you in that moment.

I know that I used to live in a lot of shame.

And so those shameful messages would just flow out of me.

And it was only through coming to know the grace of God

that those have lessened.

I'm not perfect, and I still get it wrong sometimes.

But the shameful messages have been replaced with more

grace-infused message.

And that's only because I'm coming to know the grace of God

for me.

We as individuals struggle with this.

Collectively, I think, as Christians,

we struggle with it.

What was your message to the church be?

The message to the church would be to give the Gospel--

to give that good news of Jesus Christ, which is,

He came to save sinners, to rescue us, and transform us

in His likeness.

Because we can't give away what we don't have.

We can't give away what we don't have.

Yeah.

So we need to be certain we understand

within our own hearts God's grace for us

so that we can give it away to our children.

It's not just a responsibility, but such a privilege

to be able to do that.

You can get more of Jeannie's great advice

by getting her book.

It's called Mom Set Free.

Find relief from the pressure to get it all right.

And what mom doesn't feel that?

It's available in stores nationwide.

What a great message, Jeannie.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Great to have you with us.